lee_yl\" post_id=\"2117051\" time=\"1692671775\" user_id=\"17023:

There was another classmate one year younger than her because MOE allowed her to skip one year of school!!

Just curious about the grade jumper.
Did this happen recently and can you reveal which GEP school that was?
I heard from some friends that MOE said that this is not allowed anymore.

dotb\" post_id=\"2116829\" time=\"1692451346\" user_id=\"108948:

Hello JiaLinMum,

My post was in response to an earlier post by garrybor
https://www.kiasuparents.com/kiasu/forum/viewtopic.php?p=2116464#p2116464

In the post, He thought that almost all GEP entrants must have recieved external training or specific guidance from parents, and that those who claim not to have 'prepared' actually cram in private. And that all this talk of not preparing is propaganda, and the 'locals' who buy into this idea of not preparing are losing out to those who do train.

My post was to cite that there are actual cases of not preparing, and getting in (as in my children), and from my knowledge and experience, it is not as 'rare' as he perceived. I do not have the numbers, and I refrain from saying things like 'most cases are like this, or that', but hope that from my own observation of parents and children I've known, shed some light that it is not that 'rare' to not prepare.

As for the experience that children in GEP facing challenges, I'm quite certain that I did not specifically said that was the experience I had, or had observed. I was sharing my own thoughts that if it is true that a child that is not suitable, got into the program by extra training, then the child might find difficulty. And I mentioned, as an example, to take into cosideration that PSLE prep for kids in this program comes later than those in mainstream, and possibly for a child that require more practice would end up having to go for extra lessons.

These were my thoughts, in summary, and I did not mentioned I saw this happening to any of my child's schoolmates back then. Though this does not mean it will not happen or could not have happened.

On hindsight, if my post had not been in response to the earlier post by a fellow member here, it could be seen like a 'boast' of some sort, but seriously this was not my intention. I've always been a supporter of not preparing, and the seeing the earlier post fram garrybor, I thought I should just share my thoughts, with parents of children who will be taking the selection tests.

And yes, my post and I, are genuine. And my children were accepted into the program.

I hope this clarifies the intention of my post, if it still doesn't, please PM me if you want further clarification.

OMG, your tone seems to be dragging me into your \"discussion\" with jialinmum.
I feel that you are re-phrasing my words to make it sound more confrontational.

1) You said that \"He thought that almost all GEP entrants must have recieved external training or specific guidance from parents\".

What I actually said was \"I think that any child goes in without some sort of “enrichment”, be it external or at home is extremely unlikely: maybe it is simply that the child reads a lot, or maybe it is that the parents guide at home\"

The word enrichment was in quotes because for lack of another word, I meant to say that even a good supply of books is considered beneficial for GEP admission.

Since you said that your child reads a lot, (and I presume you bought many of the books), I believe you can agree with the spirit of this point.



2) You said that I meant \"And that all this talk of not preparing is propaganda, and the 'locals' who buy into this idea of not preparing are losing out to those who do train.\"\"

I actually said \"I think the locals are eating our lunch eaten here because some locals are actually buying into the propaganda while other are happily sharing and exchanging tips and resources (and getting their kids into the GEP).\"

Indeed, I meant that the locals are losing out. I did not say that locals were completely excluded.

How does citing actual cases of not preparing change the reality?
I am sure nobody doubts that there are such cases.

Perhaps it is the number of such cases that we disagree about, in which case I invite you to do a Google search and look at the claims made by the prep centers.


3) Can you reveal when your child got into the GEP? Was it in recent years or say, more than 5 years ago?
The landscape (for GEP prep) is significantly different in the last 5 years or so.

Also, you mentioned that \"And I mentioned, as an example, to take into cosideration that PSLE prep for kids in this program comes later than those in mainstream, and possibly for a child that require more practice would end up having to go for extra lessons.\"

My own experience in recent years is that MOE and the school has managed and prepared for this very well, with a lot of communications and working together with the parents. So at least for my children's school, I do not think that this concern exists.

And in any case, what is to stop any parent/child from preparing for PSLE earlier if they really have difficulties?
Perhaps the experience is different for different schools.


4) I can see your reasons for advocating zero preparations.

AHsDad\" post_id=\"2116669\" time=\"1692335921\" user_id=\"172457:

100% agree with dotb.

Forumers here need balanced views and not be swayed by extreme kiasuism, where GEP is seen as an aspiration / achievement.

Its risky for a “prepared” kid to enter GEP if not suited. Eg. PSLE preparation impacted, extra tuition, low self-esteem and DSA may be affected too, among others.

GEP is celebrating 40 yrs this year. It’s not perfect but has been quite tried and tested, and rather updated. Hoping Parents not stress on GEP please, cos u will pass down this unnecessary stress to ur kids. 🙏🏽

I suspect this climate is why there are so few GEP related posts on KSP.

Because they are all being discussed (very heavily) elsewhere….

STmummy\" post_id=\"2114710\" time=\"1690363918\" user_id=\"46864:

No preparation is required. The child must in the first place enjoys solving Math questions, then he/she will be able to benefit from the program. If just want to get into GEP by going for many preparation classes, but the child does not like to do challenging questions, he/she will not enjoy the process.

The GEP cohort is around 350 each year. Just 3 large centers offering GEP prep all claim around 150 kids each. That’s higher than the cohort size.

So there is obviously double counting or statistical massaging somewhere.

I think that any child goes in without some sort of “enrichment”, be it external or at home is extremely unlikely: maybe it is simply that the child reads a lot, or maybe it is that the parents guide at home. There are certainly many who pretend that “we never prepare” while they furiously cram at home.

Suppose we want to select the top 350 fastest runners or swimmers (or any other sports) among the kids. Will there be some kid who has not practiced or tried the sport excel simply because they are naturally talented? Unlikely right? The logic is the same for GEP.

The selection test is a timed one. A naturally gifted child may still do solve a question slower than another (less talented one) who has seen it before.

I think the locals are eating our lunch eaten here because some locals are actually buying into the propaganda while other are happily sharing and exchanging tips and resources (and getting their kids into the GEP).

doodbug\" post_id=\"2115059\" time=\"1690776638\" user_id=\"13281:

I have no issue with GEP in its current form of three years (compared to the initial incarnation of GEP as a 7-year programme previously (with majority joining in at P4 and a small number articulating in at Sec 1). What I would say though that should be removed, is the EESIS privilege, which to me, should be based on PSLE results as it is the case for all Singapore students.

Banning GEP prep is not the way to go. The programme is desirable, and is aspirational for some. If you ban the prep at Centres, then it will just go somewhere in the black market. Something else will come to take its place. I am okay with kids who make it due to the prep - am of the view that prep would not work for 90% of the population in any case, it's really the top 5 or 10% that may get into the programme due to prep. So be it if that is the case.

My kids for example, will never stand a chance at GEP even if I were to send them for prep. And I am sure it applies to many other kids. And I think they got a very solid education and educational experience, even though they were not in GEP.

GEP Kids do not have automatics ESIS or DSA privilege, at least not now.
ESIS is based purely on PSLE results.
DSA, lots of GEP kids get rejected too.

Hello there,


I am excited to announce that I am continuing the tradition of offering a more affordable alternative for students to prepare for the GEP selection test, as many centers tend to overcharge. This workshops will be held onsite for a period of 5 (or 6) days in June.

Our goal is to level the playing field for talented students who may have limited exposure to resources and ensure that they have a fair chance to succeed. The pricing for this workshop is extremely fair and non-exploitative.

We focus on quality over quantity and prefer to work with a select group of students whom we can provide individualized attention to. Our approach is centered on providing a wider exposure, rather than cramming or intense pressure.

We have only 4 slots left as of today, May 1st.
If you are interested in letting your child join an exclusive community, please take a look at the Avocado Lab website Facebook page.

Best regards,

Garry
Avocado Lab

sushi88\" post_id=\"2093028\" time=\"1671676263\" user_id=\"100857:

. Good that you know how to say \"thank you\" and make a graceful exit after creating a drama out of your own marketing act

However, if you truly feel you have angered me for launching a personal attack of who I am, an apology would show sincerity.
Just for the record, if there is no apology, life still goes on for me, so there is no pressure.

If you can lose existing students due to this marketing act, \"discerning\" parents are not seeing the value in your service. This is my thinking as a parent. The merit in a centre for me is what works for my kid. Marketing is what a centre has to do for their biz but not a value I will tag on if my kid is already studying in the centre and enjoying the value of service.

You know you do not have to feel uneasy about marketing in business as long as what you provide is real information and not illegal ie, info is copyrighted or consent is not granted, albeit it is not directly linked to you. This is a takeaway for you in this drama you have created.

You made me laugh so hard with your delusions!

sushi88\" post_id=\"2092944\" time=\"1671629343\" user_id=\"100857:

Is this getting personal? You conjure this “I am smart and I am happy other parents see my point” post in your head? I have confessed before to one parent that \"I am not smart\" because half the time I cannot comprehend what some posters are writing, beyond my comprehension I told this parent.

This is a good example of emotions over rationale and a non-stop witch-hunting of an innocent post.

Firstly, the statement, “ That is so marketing to publish overall AL score when they have no impact on the other 2 subjects” is a FACTUAL statement with marketing impact. It is a FACT that you offer only 2-3 subjects but you published the results of overall. Now, is Marketing a BAD, FOUL word? If it is, then nobody will attend marketing courses anymore. :lol: Marketing techniques pique interest and MARKETING is ESSENTIAL in business. And I am addressing the word MARKETING is the problem you have with me since you did not take offence when the first poster said why mentioned overall AL score when only 2 core subjects and I replied to it? :?
Also, FACTUALLY you know you DO NOT offer ALL FOUR subjects, so to give extra information on overall result is marketing right?? :slapshead: It will make people ask more questions, isn't this the outcome?

Secondly, after this statement, I also mentioned that many tuition centres put up overall T-scores as marketing suggesting it as a COMMON MARKETING practice.

Thirdly, just because 2 parents informed you then you have to irrationally jump on another parent? Sheesshh. That was so impulsive. Maybe when you have calmed down, you would like to thank me for telling you that the word marketing is not a bad word.

I make no apology for what I said because my conscience is clear and there was no malice nor intent of attack on any particular centre except to say that it is a common marketing practice that would have slipped my eyes as opposed to the eagle-eyed parent whom I kudo-ed. Also, I ALWAYS write responsibly because that is WHAT I EXPECT of others in a public forum. POFMA was born out of feedback from people like me.

Wait till you read about someone calling everyone's kids a \"gong gia\" to choose JC over Poly choice and thrash them in the uni, then you understand what is a writing problem in a public forum.

If you do not appreciate a constructive feedback when you see one, at least do not launch a personal attack. Thank you. I reiterate....MARKETING IS NOT A FOUL WORD if you are in business. I hope you understand that you are attacking a parent plus the friends circle who could be potential clients for you.

Thank you for your reply and concern.
Fortunately the student parents coming to us are discerning. I will leave it to the readers to decide who is the angry one here.

sushi88\" post_id=\"2092851\" time=\"1671606057\" user_id=\"100857:

Woah, so surprised to hear from the horse's mouth.. Congratulations all Math students got AL1 and only 1 did not. At least I know tuition for Math is still good for kids who want to get AL1 considering results seem so uncertain for some kids in the new system.

The intent of my post was actually to point out to this parent who posted that he/she always has a good eye for detail and read information accurately and I kudos that coz as a parent, I might not have picked that out if it was not highlighted. Just an encouragement for this parent who always posts good information. Also, to state generally that many tuition centres in the past actually published the T-score as a common marketing practice, so it was quite a commonly-used marketing approach it seemed and hence someone like me would feel oblivious to it. So there was nothing personal about your centre per se.

If you are truly not bothered, you would not have made this post. :?

Also, you mentioned this info was only shared with your students but the moment I clicked on the webpage, the info of pride stared back blatantly at my face, how was this only sharing with YOUR students on a World Wide Web? :?
I am confused by your explanation so a suggestion is if you have put information in a public space as a business, be prepared for comments by random people to be made coz your awkward defence made it worse.... in Chinese we say... \"越描越黑“....let your good work on the AL1 students do the talking. Since CNY is round the corner, 祝你生意兴隆

You may not believe it but not everybody in the industry is out to fool parents or make a quick buck.

We genuinely teach kids because we are passionate about it. That’s why we are a small, center; we only open classes based on the key coaches’ schedules. We do not use “paid per hour” coaches

It may seem to you like a harmless “I am smart and I am happy other parents see my point” post but it is irresponsible and unfounded in this case.

I did not even know about your post. I am overseas and was notified by 2 of my students’ parents of your
statement “ That is so marketing to publish overall AL score when they have no impact on the other 2 subjects”. What do you even know about us??

If you are a parent, I hope you can exercise some responsibility in your future comments.

kaisuism\" post_id=\"2092860\" time=\"1671607560\" user_id=\"199574:

ok, so 70% AL 4, 60% AL 4D, which means is 130% AL 4?

Or AL 4 D is 60%, and 10% is AL 4(no HMT) total 70% AL 4?

Or 70% got AL 4 for Math and 60% got AL 4D total?

Then what about the average 4.9? How to get that figure?

Yes, it is for 4 subjects and not math alone. We are a math Olympiad center. AL1 for PSLE school math is the default score.