Is GEP really necessary?

[2ppaamm]

toddles:

2ppaamm:

As it is, we have low spending in education, weird gifted programs and real gifted children left in the cold, unequal advantage given to children identified at P3, etc. These just do not make sense to me.

Low spending in education as relative to defense? cos MOE gets second highest budget every year.

But yes, I totally agree that smaller class sizes are the way to go, across the board, for ALL schools. It will help solve a whole spectrum of problems.
i) more attention/better quality teaching to each child
ii) less severely overworked teachers (marking wise)
iii) more order in class, less crowd control discipline issues

Train more teachers, hire more teachers, teach the teachers WELL.

Recall it was also in some opposition manifesto to increase the teaching workforce and regulate/curtail the less value-add industries.

Recently heard it said again by a respected academic - why should there be so many real estate agents? cut them by half! channel resources into attracting ppl into meaningful, true value add professions like teaching that help in nation building.

Not to offend realtors, but objectively, is their value add commensurate with the commission? everyone is just leeching on unsustainable property prices in the current baseless euphoria. perhaps there should be a severe crash /rightful correction in the ppty market, then resources can be channeled to more meaningful economic sectors. and even if there isn't, should there be a cap on commission? does a person selling a $39m ppty do very much more than someone who sells a $700k one?

Teachers are already being paid relatively well, but if class sizes are reduced, we'll need many more teachers. no need to pay each teacher more, just need to channel more budget into paying more teachers.

Small education budget per head as compared to the rest of the developed countries.

[Nebbermind]

Nothing much to add....juz sharing something I just came across


http://hedgehogcomms.blogspot.com/2012/04/why-villainising-gep-does-no-one-any.html

Any thoughts to share?

[toddles]

Nebbermind:

Nothing much to add....juz sharing something I just came across


http://hedgehogcomms.blogspot.com/2012/04/why-villainising-gep-does-no-one-any.html

Any thoughts to share?

A balanced treatment of the whole issue.

[2ppaamm]

Don't get me wrong, I respect Monica Lim and think that she is a very nice and diplomatic person. But here are the flaws on first instance reading her write up:


1. Where is the definition of giftedness taken from? 1%? Mensa is 2%. So Mensa is wrong and Singapore's GEP is more accurate? Who is 'researchers'?

2. Giftedness manifests itself at 9? Where on earth is this information from? So how do we explain children who go to universities before they reached their teens, and clearly have their giftedness manifested way before their own school going years begin? So developed countries that have IEPs for their gifted youngs even before 5 are all wrong and Singapore is right? Hm...

3. I agree with the abolishment of the privileges. But I also challenge the validity of the GEP selection tests. Like I have asked many times, why do boys always double the girls in GEP. EVERY YEAR.

4. Why is someone who is dyslexic but a genius in Maths not allowed to go into GEP simply because he cannot read. He is less gifted than a child is on average better at both?

5. What about level of giftedness? Not even a consideration amongst those in GEB.

Can think of loads more. But have no vested interest in this at all, since none of my kids are in it anymore. But certainly, this is not a balanced view. Having seen and worked with gifted teachers in other countries and other education systems, I can say ours is not a gifted system. It is a system to nurture that bunch of kids (not necessarily all gifted) that are identified useful for the system. Not necessarily for the children involved. Along the way, it was also redesigned to fit the benefits of those who are running and administering the program, not the identified ones.

Sorry, maybe when you have tasted blood, tomato juice just taste terrible. But we should really make our blood taste better not try to fool ourselves into believing that tomato juice is blood. :evil:

[jtoh]

Hi Pam, on your point #4, just wanted to say that I do know of at least one child who is dyslexic and who got into GEP.


As for giftedness manifesting itself at age 9, I read somewhere that giftedness manifests itself before age 9 and it’s best to test for giftedness before then. In fact 9 is at the end of the testing zone. Don’t ask me for references because I can’t remember where I read it from. It was ages ago.

[upsidedown]

jtoh:

Hi Pam, on your point #4, just wanted to say that I do know of at least one child who is dyslexic and who got into GEP.


As for giftedness manifesting itself at age 9, I read somewhere that giftedness manifests itself before age 9 and it's best to test for giftedness before then. In fact 9 is at the end of the testing zone. Don't ask me for references because I can't remember where I read it from. It was ages ago.

curious how the dylexic child passes the english tests.

[nansk]

[quote]Giftedness manifests itself at 9?[/quote]
No, I don't think this is true. Maybe the MoE waits until the end of P3 to give a chance to gifted children from underprivileged backgrounds to catch-up in terms of language ability?
[quote]why do boys always double the girls in GEP. EVERY YEAR.[/quote]I have also wondered about this. Is the test heavily weighed on quantitative skills? I have heard that girls are stronger in verbal skills. Could this be the reason there are more boys identified by the test?

[2ppaamm]

nansk:

I have also wondered about this. Is the test heavily weighed on quantitative skills? I have heard that girls are stronger in verbal skills. Could this be the reason there are more boys identified by the test?

Don't think so. My son told me the verbal test could be more difficult, and according to the GEB and the psychological tests, he is more gifted in language than math. So, I am pretty sure the language tests are not easy at all, I think there is some selection criteria that are not revealed, or perhaps some kind of quota for each gender.

[laughingcat]

upsidedown:

jtoh:

Hi Pam, on your point #4, just wanted to say that I do know of at least one child who is dyslexic and who got into GEP.


As for giftedness manifesting itself at age 9, I read somewhere that giftedness manifests itself before age 9 and it's best to test for giftedness before then. In fact 9 is at the end of the testing zone. Don't ask me for references because I can't remember where I read it from. It was ages ago.

curious how the dylexic child passes the english tests.

That is interesting thought as well. But verbal vs written test/exam are totally diiferent. Look at LKY and Dr Lee Wei Ling as both are dylexic. I am pretty sure their language are powerful.

[2ppaamm]

laughingcat:

upsidedown:

[quote=\"jtoh\"]Hi Pam, on your point #4, just wanted to say that I do know of at least one child who is dyslexic and who got into GEP.


As for giftedness manifesting itself at age 9, I read somewhere that giftedness manifests itself before age 9 and it's best to test for giftedness before then. In fact 9 is at the end of the testing zone. Don't ask me for references because I can't remember where I read it from. It was ages ago.

curious how the dylexic child passes the english tests.

That is interesting thought as well. But verbal vs written test/exam are totally diiferent. Look at LKY and Dr Lee Wei Ling as both are dylexic. I am pretty sure their language are powerful.[/quote]But they grow out of it or become cope with it, and because most are at least of average intelligence, some can excel in the language. I understand it is also language specific. Being dyslexic does not mean you are so for all languages. http://www.infinitylearningskills.com/inablities.htm

The worst hit are those K to P4. That's when the GEP tests are done. Unless the children identified gifted were identified in the era prior to the current GEP criteria, it is highly unlikely (in fact not possible) for a dyslexic child to qualify for GEP. Prior to this, GEB used to admit them based on either Math or English only. This has already changed, which I believe is wrong, and compromises our need to nurture those who are gifted in either area, not one who aggregates well.