PENAL CODE 377A Significance

[Estéema]

We shld also be particular concern abt decriminising suicide attempts.


This is w reference to the argument put forth by MP in 2007, under the heading ‘lack of enforcement’…

Abolishing this can provide basis to abolish 377A in the future.

We shld stand firm on some penal codes, esp in this case when politicians hv made public statements.

We also know that ‘lack of enforcement’ has always been the basis why 377A has remained.

[floppy]

Estéema:

...
We also know that ‘lack of enforcement’ has always been the basis why 377A has remained.

Actually, this is precisely the reason why this section should be repealed. You can’t have something in there but then say, it’s ok because it won’t be enforced :? Then the rest of the statutes how? Do we let some fellow suka suka arbitrary decide to enforce or not to enforce other sections as well?

Seriously, elected lawmakers (aka PAP / WP MPs) should step up and do the right thing and not worry about losing political capital with the Christian Right (ha... who are we kidding expecting politicians to do the right thing apart from looking after their own interest).

[Estéema]

Not enforced does not equate toneed to rid a nec law.


We’ve to look deeper. What was the purpose of putting in the 377A? We need to extrapolate removing it in u’stand’g of a special group in granting them that freedom, are there issues caused down the line?

We’re grappling with low birth rates & dwindling population ard the world. Then I wonder if my kids & my nieces & nephews all opt for same sex relationship/marriage, what wld happen?

I hv a niece who married only to find her new hubby was a heterosexual & still maintaining an active sexual relationship with the other party. She was so broken she cldnt open her heart for a long time out of despair & lost hope to pure, unadulterated love. It’s not just her issue, it affected parents, grandparents & I hope the other nephews & nieces not traumatized by this the way my BIL was affected & stalled his happiness coz he was so terrified meeting ppl & end up with the wrong partner (he had a bad experience witnessing a relationship went wrong when young).

Grandparents will be upset family lineage not continued, adopted kids for one generation but what abt subsequent ones? What’s happening to mankind? When is this end game? Can we reverse it if we see the negative impact or will we be able to? How does nature works, once natural procreation starts dwindling? Possible to reverse?

I shudder to think of impact. I wish to hv my kids grow up in normal society ard tt provides good influence & themselves find love & grow their own families hv hv good health & happiness with extended families.

I am concern. Not abt religious issue. Practical human continuity issue.

[Estéema]

The issue is very deep & negative impact can spread over many areas of our human life. But at the end of it, there’s a need to support the recovery to nolmacy of things that has gone awry. We as individuals & as a society hv somewhere along the lines contributed to individuals who hv gone off track.


But hey, who am I to judge, but a lot of work to do with watching & guiding our own kids as they grow. Understand them & lead them well. On the other hand, see how to caringly bring these individuals back on normal track. Not easy.

But the law is diff. Exercising 377A is nec for the whole of society & perpetuity. Alr hv many ppl I know (frds or relatives) who remain single & not even in any same sex relationships. Some express wish to avoid divorces, some fear the commitment, some can’t take the stress & demands of married life or parenthood, and then those who ‘wish’ for relationships but no social skills.

So, as parents we need to take our God given role (whatever religion u hold on to) & responsibility to a deeper level. Exercise yr right in tandem with society & exercise our role as parents to guide personally at comfort & security of home.

[lexis]

Maybe the ones who are causing the breakdown of the family unit are those who oppose gay relationships, and make it hard for their loved ones to come out because they know they won’t be accepted.


It is your right to "guide personally at [sic] the comfort & security of home", and no one is refuting that. But as a law, 377A cannot stand if it is not intended to be enforced.

The law is not the bible, and it stands independent of religion or a family’s moral values. It is supposed to be just, and applied without fear or favour. And if it will not be enforced, or is not intended to be enforced, it should be repealed.

[Estéema]

I don’t think "lack of enforcement" shld be the appropriate expression. Intent is critical. If the law is there & there’s no serious issues, or open behavior that affects others can be persuaded then there’s no necessity to be hard on anyone.


We hv rules against noise level after 10pm (or was it 11pm?), but our police go very gentle instead of "enforcing" & start arresting ppl when they disturb the communities peace & right to rest. I had witnessed a lady going thro the night shouting her partner abused her, but when the police came, she initially wail & wld not be persuaded. Residents were scolding & betrating her to keep her problems in her home then to shout to whole neighborhood. Police diplomatically brought her to a far end & calmed her down, explain to her risks based on law & she quietly returned to her home. I don’t think police can’t just arrest her for the length of time she was shouting before & after police presence. Don’t think there’s lack of enforcement but the need to settle amicably as a 优雅 society w/o acting like we’re in developing, backward country hv to go hard down.

MIL was sharing a recent case where police called in coz the lower neighbor can’t sleep fr making noise at funeral wake. After police left, MIL said police shld hv arrested w/o giving chance coz one lady shouting "only once in a year not every year someone die, just give me a chance to get back some winnings & not stressed family needs". There are ppl who think only fr their point of view but not those amongst our community.

So, every family hv their own values. What is normal & acceptable to me may be sth tt causes upheaval & heartbreak to ano.

[pirate]

No need to abolish s377A. Just delete the words "or private" will do.

[lexis]

Another issue i have with having 377A is that it lends justification to discrimination. It’s a form of legalised discrimination, isn’t it?


Already there is so much discrimination - R21 rating for Modern Family on netflix because of a gay couple, some organisations won’t hire people based on their sexuality, library books being culled because of certain content… heaven forbid schools openly discuss LGBT issues in an objective manner…

If we want to move forward to be a real first world country, i think we have to accept that we need to be progressive in thought and behaviour too. We aren’t going to get there just by adopting e-payments.

[Fried chicken]

:goodpost: Lexis, I couldn’t agree more! Well said.